70 DEVON HOWARD - Mid Length Crash Course
Ever wondered why your mid-length board feels sluggish or frustrating? You're probably riding it wrong — and Devon Howard is here to help.
Whether you're a shortboarder looking to explore more glide or a longboarder aiming for versatility, mid-length surfboards offer a beautiful, flowing style of surfing — if you understand how to ride them correctly. This episode clears up the confusion and helps you finally get the most from your mid-length.
Learn the key design differences between single fins, 2+1s, and twin fins — and when to use each
Discover why your shortboard habits may be sabotaging your mid-length sessions
Hear Devon’s practical tips for size selection, duck diving, and rail engagement for more speed and style
Press play to unlock smoother turns, better flow, and a deeper connection with your mid-length board.
@devon_howard.
https://www.instagram.com/devon_howard/?hl=en
Inspiration: https://cisurfboards.com/products/ci-mid
Devon surfing https://vimeo.com/445271963
Torren Martyn https://youtu.be/cOHc2TSvCI8
Mikey Feburary https://youtu.be/exwNbChf_oc
Alex Knost https://youtu.be/e91uJK4vr10
Machado https://youtu.be/feTz87pDMWs
Key Points
Devon discusses the mid-length surfboard category, including egg, long fishes, and single fins, emphasizing the broad spectrum of designs within this category.
Devon explains the evolution and characteristics of the egg design surfboard, including its history with Donald Takayama and Skip Fry, and its suitability for different wave conditions.
Michael compares the experience of riding a mid-length surfboard to a step-up board, emphasizing the importance of drawing lines out and surfing off the rail.
Devon discusses the inspiration behind his mid-length surfing style, referencing Tom Curran and Torrin Martin, and explains his preference for certain fin configurations based on wave conditions.
Devon explains the modern evolution of mid-length surfboards at Channel Islands, blending traditional and modern design elements to suit various surfing conditions.
Devon and Michael discuss the technique of duck diving a mid-length surfboard, emphasizing safety and the importance of body positioning and strength.
Devon advises on the appropriate wave conditions for riding a mid-length surfboard, suggesting chest-high to a few feet overhead waves as ideal.
Michael and Devon discuss the benefits of owning multiple types of surfboards, including mid-length, longboard, and shortboard, to enhance surfing skills and enjoyment.
Outline
Introduction to Mid-Length Surfboards
Devon Howard introduces mid-length surfboards as a category that includes boards between shortboards and longboards.
The mid-length category includes various shapes such as eggs, long fishes, and 70s style single fins.
Devon mentions that the term 'mid-length' was coined by surf shops about 20 to 30 years ago as a catch-all category.
Characteristics and Advantages of Mid-Length Surfboards
Mid-length surfboards have a lower rocker compared to shortboards, making it easier to achieve trim speed.
They offer more surface area, which aids in quicker planing and easier speed generation.
Mid-length boards provide a moderate approach to surfing, offering a balance between the ease of longboards and the maneuverability of shortboards.
Riding Techniques for Mid-Length Surfboards
Devon recommends approaching mid-length surfing with a blank slate, especially for those coming from a shortboard background.
The technique involves less pumping and more rail engagement, with a focus on maintaining speed and flow.
Surfers should aim for longer, drawn-out bottom turns and adjust their riding style based on wave conditions.
Inspirational Surfers and Designs
Tom Curran and Torrin Martin are cited as inspirational figures in mid-length surfing.
Devon mentions the importance of rail length in achieving smooth, drawn-out lines in surfing.
The discussion includes various fin configurations such as single fins, twin fins, and tri-fins, each offering different riding experiences.
Modernization of Mid-Length Surfboards
Channel Islands has modernized mid-length surfboards by combining traditional and modern elements.
The modernized designs feature updated rails and bottoms, such as the double barrel concave or Spiral V, for improved performance.
Devon notes that the modernization has helped break past the stigma associated with mid-length boards.
Sizing and Selection of Mid-Length Surfboards
Devon suggests starting with a board about a foot over one's height for average ability surfers.
For high-level surfers or those with a strong shortboard background, a board 10 to 12 inches over height is recommended.
The thickness of the board should be relative to the shaper, with Devon preferring boards not less than two and three-quarters thick.
Appropriate Wave Conditions for Mid-Length Surfboards
Mid-length surfboards are best suited for chest-high to a few feet overhead waves.
In small waves, a fish or a shortboard is more appropriate due to the cumbersome nature of mid-length boards in such conditions.
Devon advises being patient and using half turns and redirects in small waves when riding a mid-length board.
Duck Diving Techniques for Mid-Length Surfboards
Devon explains the technique of duck diving a mid-length board, emphasizing the importance of a strong push-up game.
The scoop technique involves pushing pressure on one rail and dipping the board under the water.
Safety precautions are discussed, including avoiding tailgating and ensuring there is enough space when duck diving.
General Advice on Surfboard Choices
Devon recommends having a variety of boards, including a shortboard, a mid-length, and a longboard, to suit different wave conditions.
The importance of having the right equipment for improving surfing skills is emphasized.
Devon encourages reaching out on Instagram for further questions and discussions.
Transcription
Michael Frampton
Before you put that phone down, please just give us a rating. Just a quick five-star rating. It's the best way to support the show. Thanks.
Devon Howard
You're looking to... experience, I think, something really unique and beautiful, a beautiful style of surfing. The mid-length could be for you.
Michael Frampton
What is a mid-length surfboard? What conditions should I surf it in? How should I surf it? Who should I look to for inspiration? What size should I get? My second interview with Devon Howard.
Devon Howard
How to surf what people call a mid-length, which is a catch-all term for boards in between shortboards and longboards. Within the mid-length category, you have the egg, which is probably the most popular shape. And then you have long fishes. You know, you have the '70s-style single fins. It's a pretty broad category.
Michael Frampton
The surfboard model that you and Channel Islands worked on, would you call that an egg?
Devon Howard
Yeah, it's an egg, but it's sort of a sleek, pulled egg. I think in the '90s people would call it a speed egg, which sounds like some kind of drug, but it's really—yeah, it does come from an egg design. In the late '90s, Donald Takayama introduced me to one of his designs. He just called it the Trifin Egg, and it wasn't new at the time. I was like, that's a cool board from the '80s. And he's like, well, no, we've been making these since the '70s. Skip Frye invented this design. This was Donald Takayama's version of it. And I took it on a surf trip down to Mexico in the late '90s. Yeah, I really connected with it because sometimes the waves are a little on the, you know, a little bit too big for a longboard, because I do come from a longboard background primarily. And I would ride longboards in all sizes, no matter how big it got, because the longboards I rode in the '90s had little side bites on them. Kind of the—people called them a high-pro. But the Takayama high-pro boards were a little tamer. They weren't super extreme rockers, and the edge of the tail was a little tucked, so they were kind of a blend between the new and the old. But his egg was just a cut-down, you know—instead of a 9'2" or a 9'4", now I was riding—the one he gave me at the time was a 7'6". And so I was able to ride that, especially when I go to the North Shore or go on a trip, like took it to J-Bay. It was an insane board in Jeffreys Bay. And what's really nice about the board, for someone like me that's coming from primarily a longboard background, is when the waves get hollower or more critical, or it doesn't really make a lot of sense that I'm going to nose ride at all, then there's no need for all the board up there. And now I'm more focused on the center sort of trim zone. And then moving my feet back to turn, sort of moving forward. If you look at videos of surfers from the early '70s on through the mid to late '70s, you have Michael Peterson-type people, surfers who were riding egg-inspired boards. Full shapes, full templates. All the way to someone like a Gerry Lopez who was riding like a Dick Brewer... mini-gun. Those were kind of long and drawn out. All of those surfers would move around on the board a little bit, and they were usually moving forward or trim and tube riding. And then when they wanted to turn, they would take a step back, and you'd see them scoot back, put their back foot over the fin, and then turn the board. With mid-length boards, when you're thinking about how do I approach riding one, I think it depends on your experience level. But if we just sort of take the intermediate perspective—if you're coming from a shortboard and you're moving up to a mid-length, that's a bigger jump, an adjustment, than it is going from a longboard down to one. And the reason being that eggs and mid-length boards, they have much lower rocker. So the entry rocker is much lower, as opposed to the Channel Islands right behind you—the shortboard right behind your shoulder is going to have a bit more rocker. And it's shorter and narrower, so it has less surface area. And when you have less surface area to generate speed and to get up to planing speed, you have to pump the board. Pump. And I think why a lot of people like the mid-size, mid-length egg-type boards is more surface area, lower rocker, much less effort to get up to trim speed. Because there's so much width and planing surface, just like a boat or any planing hull, you get up and going. It's quicker and easier when you have more surface area. Then on the far end of that could be a longboard, which is even easier. However, when you want to turn, now with the longboard you have a lot more board, and it can be unwieldy to a lot of people. That's why a lot of folks that ride shortboards don't care for longboards. They want to turn and be a bit more aggressive on the wave. Mid-lengths are sort of like a nice neutral—not neutral, but a moderate approach to surfing. You know, it's a solid, I think, like a middle ground. Why they use the term mid-length—mid-length is something that I think surf shops came up with 20 or 30 years ago. Because you're a customer, you walk into a surf shop, and it's like, we have our shortboards, we have our longboards, and we've got eggs or these other boards over here. They used to call them funboards. And this term mid-length started coming up as just a catch-all category. It's kind of like the third category. And it ends up being a nice zone for a lot of people that don't want to maybe work as hard to pump a board, and they don't want a ton of board either on the far end. And I think that kind of sets the table. What are these boards? Why are we even riding them?
Michael Frampton
I actually bought a 7-foot single fin, one of the first boards I had. So, and I used to love surfing it so much. It was, as soon as it wasn't quite shortboardable, I'd just grab my single fin. And I think they're quite versatile as well. I went sort of into longboards as well. And you're right, coming back from a longboard to the single fin or the mid-length is, I think, when you go—you shortboard it, and you start longboarding, and then you come in the middle, and it's like, now you get it. One thing I haven't really thought about much on the mid-lengths is moving around a lot with my feet. I think that's where shortboarders, they have a go on a mid-length, and they don't get it because they don't—they're not used to moving around, shuffling up the board a little bit when the wave softens out and then stepping back on the tail when the wave starts to rise up. Yes. I think that puts a lot of shortboarders off the whole mid-length thing, which is a shame because you just see them out there bumping and squiggling and trying to get speed on these tiny little waves, and they get angry, and they just might as well be on a mid-length, really.
Yeah, you know, there's sort of a critique of mid-lengths. If you ride a shortboard, you might not like the mid-length because it's a lot more board. You might feel that, hey, those people on those boards catch too many waves. I think that's a concern. But I rode these boards for years, and they were always kind of like—I would say mostly kind of an underground thing. That might be a bit of a stretch, but most lineups, there were two very identifiable shapes. It was a shortboard or a longboard. There wasn't a lot of in-between. And I remember for years people asking, like, "What is that? What are you riding? That just looks really interesting," because I was able to be at a place like a Trestles or something, you know, and it's a few feet overhead. And I was able to sit outside with the older guys on longboards and catch the waves just as easily as they did. I was a little bit out past some of the shortboarders, except the really good ones who could paddle well were out there with me. But it's not about catching waves to me, and it's not about it being easy. It's about a feeling you get. And there's a certain sensation I would get from a shortboard pumping and then hitting the lip, or doing an air—which I can't do an air—but I could imagine that it'd be pretty amazing if I could. And I know what it feels like to nose ride and do those sorts of things, but there's this in-between zone that—they're really long arcs. It's really similar to snowboarding. If anyone listening snowboarded, you have your park, where that's typically like it's packed or it's groomed.
And then you have the sort of carving approach, which is, I'm looking for powder, and I'm just doing these long... long arcs. And when you tap into a mid-length and you're really surfing at its potential, it's long rail surfing. If you're able to find a video—if you Googled my name—you might come across a video or two that Channel Islands has put out there. I think that's a good demonstration of what I'm talking about. And you'll see when I go rail to rail, I'm going to the bottom, putting all the rail in, and then I go up. And as I'm coming back down, there's like three-quarters of the rail. There's a lot of rail engagement. The misconception could be as I catch a wave, I go down the line, and I just sort of point to the shoulder. If I'm a beginner or I'm learning, that's all I'm going to do at best, whether I'm on a mid-length or a Wavestorm or a longboard. But if you're looking to experience, I think, something really unique and beautiful—a beautiful style of surfing—the mid-length could be for you. If you watch those videos, there's not a ton of downtime. As I said, I'm not just going straight. I feel the board is interesting to me when I'm really engaging with the wave. And what I mean by engaging is, you know, I'm not smashing the lip or doing an air, but I'm continuously dipping the board into the wave. And I'm trying to go as fast as I can.
So there's the rail engagement, and then in between as the board planes out on the wave, right? After I come off a bottom turn and I'm climbing up the face, now a lot of the board is sort of flat in the water and going really fast, because as—remember, we were saying earlier—all that planing surface, I'm just flying. And so, when I go into that next rail engagement, which is banking off the top and then coming... sorry, I'm putting my hands in the camera. But I'm coming back down. I'm going into it with a lot of speed. And not once do I have to pump the board. I think that's the big distinction between the surfing that you can do on a mid-length and what's special about it. You never have to pump the board. It's more like you're on a ball bearing or a gimbal, and you're just sort of like—pumping is I'm lifting the board, I'm going, tick, really fast.
Like if I'm Dane Reynolds, I'm picking the board up. And you can see as those surfers are pumping down the line, if you were to hit pause, there's moments where their boards are kind of out of the water. Wow. And they're really driving off those fins. Where with the mid-length, the fin is really there for redirection, but the trim speed is coming off of the planing hull and the positioning of the board. I'm trying to stay in and near the pocket.
Like most good surfing, it's the same with shortboarding. You want to be where the power is, which is near the pocket of the wave.
So I tap into that pocket off the bottom, and then as I come up, if there isn't a pocket there, I have to go out onto this sort of slopey shoulder. I'll bring the board back down to get back into the pocket and kind of do it again and again.
So it's like a sort of up and down linking. It's a rhythmic surfing, if that makes sense.
So again, it's a feeling you're getting out of it versus like this visceral thing, like, I'm gonna rip this wave, and I'm gonna show my buddies on the beach that I'm ripping. It's not like that. It's really like this deep personal feeling that you get. And so, the way to approach riding them, if you're coming from a shortboard, my biggest recommendation is to hit the reset button and go into riding one of these boards with a blank slate. Because if you come in thinking, I'm going to pump this board because that's how I've always done it, you're going to get frustrated, because the board's just going to feel too big. It's going to feel really cumbersome. The best way to approach it is to do nothing, maybe on the first wave or two when you're riding a mid-length for the first time. As simple and silly as that sounds, just paddle in, get up, and stand there in the middle of the board, and just don't do a whole lot. Kind of feel it out and go, "Okay, well, this is, like, in some cases, a whole extra foot of surfboard." That's a lot to kind of get used to on itself.
And then after a couple rides, paddle in.
And then just aim straight down the wave and set yourself up for a nice, drawn-out bottom turn, kind of like you would do on a step-up board.
You know, if you were going out and the waves were a bit bigger, and you've got more room to play, right? A bigger canvas.
Michael Frampton
Interesting you say that because I was already thinking of the comparisons between a step-up and a mid-length. Because you've got that longer rail, and obviously a step-up is made to be surfed in some solid waves, and you get more rail in the water. For me, that's the board I want to be on. I want to be on my 6'6" Proton Channel Islands. But it's just not often that I get that. Double overhead and barreling, so I'm not. I'm hardly ever on that board. But it's such a similar feeling from a mid-length. But it's that same sort of premise, because I find when you're surfing a step-up, you can't be like your small wave shortboard. The wave will just race on without you. You have to draw your lines out and surf off the rail on a step-up shortboard.
So that's a good analogy, I think, for shortboarders. If you've had experience on a bigger shortboard and you've realized I've got to draw my lines out a little bit more, it's more similar to that than it is shortboarding, for sure. And it's cool, that video you mentioned as well.
Yeah. I'll put it. I'll put a link to that in the show notes for those listening. And that's—I know the one you're talking about—is a perfect example of how sometimes when the wave is soft, you're like doing these little shallow... you're never just going straight like on a longboard on that mid-length. But sometimes when the wave flattens out, you're drawing your lines out longer, but you're still keeping the flow going.
And then when the wave steepens up, you start looking like Tom Curren, like pointing the nose straight to the beach. So smooth.
So they're such versatile boards.
Yeah. And Tom Curren, for me, is a big inspiration. If you are doing this Google Sheets, look at the wave that Tom Curren gets at J-Bay. I believe they say it's his first wave he ever rode at J-Bay. The truth of the matter is, if you know the story, it really wasn't. It was just the first time they were rolling the camera. And he's riding in—you remember in the early '90s—shortboards were a few inches longer. It's more in the last decade or whatever that we started shrinking the rail a little bit and distributing the foam in different ways. But look at the early Taylor Steele, all that stuff, right? Momentum. The boards were longer and they were narrow, but they had longer rail.
You see like Creed McTaggart and then the Gudauskas brothers. You've seen some of these surfers are going back and revisiting those boards, and it just...
You know, remember that guy Brendan Margeson and like all those guys? They rode these, and look at the surfing they did. So. And it was beautiful. And if you look at that Tom Curren wave, it's not a step-up board, but it's a longer rail, and it just looks insane. And he's really just using that rail. Now the surfing I'm doing is obviously not as critical and sharp as that. It's even more drawn out probably. But that is an inspiration. And you don't really see shortboard surfers drawing lines like that, because when the rail is shorter—I think this is a relevant point—when the rail gets much shorter, there's a point of diminishing returns off of the trim and the glide factor.
So when you have a little bit longer rail, even if it's just a few inches on a shortboard, you're gonna see those surfers doing more beautiful lines like a Conner Coffin or someone like that. And when they get shorter, you're going to have more of like a Gabriel Medina or Italo type of approach, where they're a little bit flatter and skatier. Because to keep that trim, and you'll see like double and triple bottom turns, and because they don't have that long rail. And I know surf coaches that try to smooth out some of their students have them order boards one or two inches longer. This is CT-level surfers. We're in a much more exaggerated sort of space when you get into mid-length, but you can kind of wrap your head around that idea.
And then make that jump up to where we are on a mid-length. Now, within that, there's lots of different designs. You know, there's fishtails, twin fins are really popular. Worth noting, Torren Martyn is probably in everyone's mind if you're going to look for inspiration, and that's another video that you probably want to put as a link or a resource. I think he's really blown the lid off on mid-length surfing. He's much younger than I am and much more fit, and comes from a really strong background.
So I look to him. He's an inspiration for myself. 48 in about a month. So what I like about Torren Martyn's approach is that he really utilizes that rail, especially in much bigger surf. And I identify with that, even though I don't surf barrels like that. We don't have those here in Southern California really, but he's using almost a similar approach. Shoulder-high and under, I ride a single fin longboard. Shoulder-high and above, I like to grab these mid-length boards. And you were mentioning single fin. You might not know this—I don't ride single fins that often. The boards that I do have them, and I do like them. But the video that you're going to share with people has little side bites on it. And the reason that I like those is it's again, it's one of those compromise moments. We were talking earlier about shortboard, longboard, and the middle ground is this mid-length thing. It's very similar with fins. You have single fin, and you have a full-on tri-fin, which the first one I received from Donald Takayama in the late '90s had three fins on it, same size. I like the longer center fin. We call it a 2+1 center fin. Joel Tudor calls them training wheels when you have the little side bites. But what you get out of that is a nice blend. You get the single fin sort of freedom feeling, but when you go and dip in off the bottom and off the top, or if you hit a flat part on a cutback, you're getting lift out of that fin near the rail, and you can feel an acceleration that most single fins don't offer. Not every single fin, but most single fins—depending on the bottom contours—really require more of the wave to really work. For example, in Southern California, most of our waves are pretty soft. You know, we don't have Akira. If you go to Rincon or Malibu, those have some oomph, and you could really make a single fin go. But if you're at like Cardiff Reef or San Onofre or Church, much softer wave. When you go out onto the corner and do a cutback, having that little side fin in is insane. And I spent a lot of time riding Lower Trestles and Windansea.
So I've always leaned toward that board. I do have a single fin that I really like.
So the Channel Islands board is called the CI Mid, and I have a single fin called a Triplane Hull Single. And I tend to grab the single fins when the waves are a bit more hollow and punchy. What I like about the single fin—it feels more free on the face.
So if you can kind of bear with me on this, the side bites give more drive off the bottom and off the top and through the flats and the cutback. But getting from point A to B on the face, I feel that there's less friction when I'm on the single fin. There's just like a... I don't feel anything, you know, because those side fins have a tiny bit of drag. And there's a trade-off. If I'm moving and grooving, I don't notice the drag. If I'm just kind of cruising and going straight, you can kind of feel a little bit that those fins are there below your feet. On the single fin, you don't feel that. However, there's a trade-off on everything. You don't get the drive and squirt, generally speaking, out of your turns. If the waves are really good and cupped out and nice, or it's barreling, then you don't need that. You're just kind of controlling the speed that's being created by the wave and the type of planing hull that you're on. I don't know if that makes sense what I'm saying, but there's a... there's a difference there of like, how do I choose?
So I choose the 2+1, which is the little side bites, the single. And let me throw in one more thing and let you jump in. Then there's the twin fin. Which is—the twin fin is what Torren Martyn's riding, and a lot of other surfers love that. I have a twin fin mid as well that I really like. I grab onto the twin fin in specific—I like the twin fin when it's really crowded and I'm on a point and there's a lot of people on the shoulder looking to drop in. The twin fin is the fastest of all three of these options. And when I get going in this up-and-down sort of pumping motion, even though we're not pumping like a shortboard, we're doing a longer coming down the line—man, the twin fin hauls ass. I'm not as comfortable on the twin fin if I do a big open carve on the face. The single fin and the 2+1—in the last half to the last quarter of the turn—it feels so much better. Have more control. The latter end of the twin fins feel a little weird to me. There's just like a little track to them. It's not bad. This is really subtle. But it's sort of a trade-off.
You know, like, what am I feeling like today? It's crowded and I need to just have that extra gear to, like, really scare people off from dropping in. But if I don't, if that's not a concern... I kind of like the 2+1 or the single fin. Does that make sense, what I'm saying?
Michael Frampton
Yeah. So when you say... you go to single finner, you're just taking the side bites out of your CI Mid?
Devon Howard
I do in some cases, but I grab a design I have that's made specifically for a single fin. The CI Mid I ride was really purposefully designed around the 2+1. Like totally dialed into that. But it works really well as a single.
And then when I made a twin fin version, I found that I needed just a little bit more rocker in the tail, so I added 1/16th of an inch, which is barely noticeable. Then, because I was able to get up and go and have more lift out of the fins, I felt I could ride it a hair shorter. So I cut it. I ride it like an inch shorter and just add a little bit of foam. This is really nerdy—nerd level stuff.
Michael Frampton
I'm aware that I'm the CI Mid, but are there other boards you guys are working on? Is there a—did you see—you mentioned a planing hull. Are you? There's one called the... it's the Triplane. It's a Triplane Hull. But it's a single fin. And the Triplane Hull is a design that Al worked on in the '70s, and the design actually really came from Australia. And there was a team rider he had that was over in Australia for a while and brought back one. It's like, "You got to try this." And Al was like, "Yeah, yeah, I don't know, maybe." And then he tried one and was like, "Whoa, this is pretty cool." And anyone that knows the brand knows that for years the Triplane Hull was a real big success. You know, even old stuff of Tom Curren riding them and Shaun Tomson, the twin fin version. So we kind of unearthed that and took this mid-length and put it on one, and I was blown away by it, because most single fins I've ridden have a V-bottom or a rolled bottom or a hull, and they feel nice, but they always felt kind of low in the water, and they felt... they lacked that oomph out of the turn. But this one, because of the bottom and the way that the water's coming through it, and you're riding on just this one little surface, hauls ass. It's pretty cool. I'll share a link of that, and you can see the difference—it just draws a different line. But regardless of who makes your boards, these sort of things I'm talking about apply. Whether you know a Christenson or Joel Tudor or whatever, there's some general principles for everybody out there, regardless of who shapes your board, that I think a conversation like this could help. You know, I get asked all the time, like, how should I ride one? You know, because I've jumped on one and it just felt like too much board. And I've had these conversations where it's: just don't bring... don't try to make your mid-length be your shortboard. That's going to be a very frustrating experience. And to me, it's a similar thing that I've shared with people that longboard. Let the longboard be a longboard. Let the mid-length be a mid-length. Don't, like, sort of push your might or your will onto the board that doesn't really want to do that. I mean, you can do whatever you want. It's surfing. There's really technically no rules. But if you want the most out of your surfing, the most out of your experience, go into it with that reset button. Feel out a few rides. Then on the next wave, get that feeling of dropping to the bottom and just pushing that rail through. That moment is, I think, a really critical one to get the most out of a mid-length. It's the same as a shortboard. You hear a lot of pro surfers talk about that bottom turn. Sets up the pace of the whole ride. I think it's really important. I've heard Julian Wilson talk about this, and a number of folks—Kelly Slater, in our docs—and the same applies to the mid-length. I think the only difference being that when you're on a shortboard and you do that first bottom turn, most surfers are trying to go straight up and attack the wave. You know, it's a little harder to do that on the mid-length because it's just a lot more board. So instead of trying to go up and smash the wave, aim for 9 or 10 o'clock.
You know? It's kind of like a running joke. It's like, yeah, I went 10 o'clock today. Because everyone wants to go 12 o'clock, which is like, I went straight up. The board generally doesn't want to do that. A high-level surfer, of course, could get that out of the board. But I say the same thing with longboards: if you're trying to shortboard your mid-length or you're trying to shortboard your longboard, my recommendation is to just stay on the shortboard, because the shortboard does that so much better, so much more effectively. And when you get more into the dance of a mid-length and a longboard, I think you get more joy out of it.
And then you're using... like, horses for courses. It's like the right board for the right person.
Michael Frampton
Well, that's the biggest point we need to drive home: the right board for the right situation, full stop.
Devon Howard
Yeah. That's what.
Michael Frampton
It is. And I mean, everyone—it seems like shortboards and longboards—and now, thankfully, the mid-length is kind of making a comeback, I guess. I'm wondering, the mid-length that you were riding in the '90s and the early 2000s, and you obviously loved it—then what have Channel Islands done to that style of board? Have they modernized it much?
Devon Howard
Yeah, you know, I don't—I think it would be a stretch to say that we've done anything sort of unique. You know, I do think that, like I was saying earlier, this board was always a bit underground. There were surfers, shapers that were doing this in the '80s and '90s. I think, in terms of Channel Islands, I do think what we did is we took the best of the old with the best of the new.
So like, that Takayama-style board that I had and loved and have so many great memories on, has more of a traditional bottom on it. So it's a V-bottom. And a V-bottom is really neutral and really positive. Doesn't do anything crazy. And a V-bottom hull holds really well when the waves are a bit bigger. And it had really forgiving rails.
The Channel Islands version is, we took one of Al Merrick's old boards—we have it here hanging on the wall—and we just traced it. But we brought in the modern Merrick rail.
And then we brought in the Merrick bottom, which in this case was the double barrel concave—or spiral V, some people call it.
So, in the center stringer, it's a little bit of a higher or a lower point, whichever way you're looking at the board. And if I put a straight edge, the center point on the bottom is going to create a type of a V, and in between those points is a little bit of concave, but it's not super deep. And what the concave does is it just gets you up and going faster when the waves are maybe a little bit gutless, you know?
And I noticed between the ones I was riding with Takayama and Channel Islands that—it wasn't that one is better than the other, that's a subjective experience—but I think the things I did like was it just felt a little crisp. And it felt a little bit faster in between point A and B when the waves were kind of average. I think once the waves get really hollow and really powerful, the differences are not as extreme. That was the big difference.
And I do think it was a hit with Channel Islands because you had a lot of long-time Channel Islands members—customers that have ridden the shortboards here for decades—and maybe you've always kind of thought, "It might be fun to try one of those," but there's a little bit of a stigma.
You know, for some people, it's a sign of getting old. You know, like, this is an old... or an old gal's board. So there's that stigma. But I think with Channel Islands doing it, it sort of broke past that. We've had other types of boards like that here for decades.
You know, Rob Machado was doing some cool stuff here years ago. And Al Merrick himself had a couple different boards—the M13 and some others—that were sort of in that. It's just... I don't know why these boards seem to be so popular now. I would say Torren Martyn's a big part of that. Maybe you want to include one of his videos. As I was saying, there's hundreds of thousands of views on it. I think people just like it because it's really relatable. It's not as relatable, maybe, to do a bunch of crazy airs. I thought of doing that right now—I would break a limb, I think.
So. Maybe that's the PR. What do you—
Michael Frampton
Think? I totally agree. I just think for most surfers, justifying riding a shortboard in average waves—it doesn't make sense. It's—your surfing suffers. And I think that folks just need to broaden their surfboard choice to suit the waves, really. Right?
I mean, I love being on a shortboard. I want to be on a shortboard. I don't think the waves often are conducive to that. Now, of course, if you're a pro surfer and your career is that dependent on surfing a shortboard, you should always be on a shortboard, mostly. That's fine. It's strange how we aspire—as shortboarders, we always aspire—to what's... I'm 80 kilos. Julian Wilson's 80 kilos, or Conner Coffin's 80 kilos. What board, what volumes? He rode it.
Well, it's a nice fantasy. But it's like, if you think you're a good driver in an American muscle car, there's no way you're going to jump in a Formula One car and do it justice. Right?
So you're better off just getting a nice... super—a V8 supercar. And to me, that's what a good mid-length is.
I mean, the video of you—and obviously watching Torren Martyn—to me, that's proof that these boards are incredibly versatile. Yeah.
I mean, I know you don't like to say "ripping," but some of those waves that you're on—the single, on the mid-length—you are ripping. You're tearing the bag out of some of those waves. Yeah, you really are. The spread. This is...
Yeah. It's just a different—thank you. That's—it’s just a different... yeah. It's just a different way of looking at it.
You know, it is a different type of ripping. I would offer this too. There's a video that we just shared recently of Mikey February at Jeffreys Bay. And I think he's a great one to look at, because he's just a beautiful surfer. And I think between—check that out—myself and Torren, the purpose of your show is for education, right? To learn how to go after these things. One thing that we didn't cover so far—well, there's two things, because there's duck diving. That's one that we should cover. The sort of dropping and climbing and the compression and springing out of the body.
So if you look up old videos from Morning of the Earth of Michael Peterson, one of the things that he was really good at—and I think was key to his surfing—and I think Rabbit picked up on this, and then Tom Curren did, and all of us today benefit from these techniques, which is: when Michael would go down to the bottom of the wave, he would sort of coil up.
Like a snake, if you will. I know that sounds a little extreme, but he would sink into his body. Go in, and as he would come out of the bottom turn, he would—if I can do this on the camera—he would bend into the board, into the bottom turn, and get really low. And as he would come off the bottom turn, he would sort of stand up and use that as a propulsion up the face of the wave.
If I'm going into a bottom turn, I would go down, and I would get real low and even tuck the back leg in and get as low as I can, engage all that rail, and as I go up the face, I'd come up. And it's a spring off the bottom of the wave. Look at the videos, and you can see how that benefits that sort of rhythm you get in.
I mean, you would be able to maybe articulate that—I don't know, in terms of kinesiology and body mechanics and whatnot—but something is truly happening there. And it feels good too, when you're doing it. You're like—you get in and you just get low. And it's like, if you've ever done some skateboarding down the driveway and you get in those, like, low—you see those people that bomb hills—you know, skiers are doing it. But the difference is, those people are using gravity and going downhill. We're... we're going kind of against and into something. And to get up there, you know, we're using a lot of things. We're using the planing surface of the board. But just like a guy pumping down the line and then doing a big air—you know, he's really kind of manhandling that moment and making it happen—we're kind of doing that with a mid-length, to slingshot ourselves down the line.
And that really sets up the other moments. Because in all surfing maneuvers, no matter what kind of surfing you're doing, if you have speed, you generally have more control, and you're more apt to make the maneuver you're doing.
Even with nose riding—if you're going really slow nose riding, what happens? The board augers in and you eat shit. But if you're at a higher planing speed in the power part of the wave and that curl—like the last time you and I talked about nose riding—that's a good thing. You want that. And the same with the mid-length. You want to be going at that top speed off the bottom.
And then it sets you up for that top turn. When you come up the face, you can do one of two things: you can redirect the board right back down the face, or if you see a long running wall, you can do something that is what people call a high line. You can kind of be critical of it because it's kind of like a little bit lazy, but who really cares? It's surfing. I don't know why sometimes we get a little too hung up on the proper way and the rules, but a high line is a pretty cool thing in the surf scene. And that's when you've seen a surfer go up and they put the board right under the lip and they just sort of ride there for a moment. And to me, it's similar to like a nose ride. It's like this little lazy moment. It feels really good, and it's just you and the wave and like... it's the ultimate freedom. And you don't really have to try to do anything. It's a really cool feeling.
And then when you're, "Okay, I've had enough of that," then you drop back down. Go back into that bottom turn and coil back up into the board and then spring out of it.
So. If that's not making sense with what I'm trying to describe here, look for that in the videos. Look at how people are going to the bottom. Alex Knost does a really good job of that, I think. Rob Machado does a really good job of it. Go and look on some of his videos. He's got a mid-length thing that he's been doing.
Michael Frampton
So, yeah. I have to admit that highlining is one of my favorite moves.
Devon Howard
It's like a lazy Sunday. You just kind of hang it out. It feels good.
Michael Frampton
Kind of. It's sort of... if I get a section of a—if I had a point break where there's a really long wall in front of me, yeah, I'm on a shortboard, I will probably just go down and hit it and then that's it. Sometimes there's a—no, I'm not going to make that section because I'm not good enough to go up and down a couple of times on that wall. I'm not fast enough. But if I'm on my mid-length or my glider, I can just get down super low and spring up and just fly. Just like you said, it feels like you're nose riding or you're in the barrel. And it's just—if you get the timing right, you just go so fast and you make sections that you thought you just couldn't make. And it actually opens up your surfing, because then you go, next time you get on a shortboard, I'm going to try a little bit of that. And you surprise yourself because of what you've learned on your mid-length from doing that. And the waves, the length of wall you can make on more rail and more volume is kind of incredible. I almost find it—the way you were describing that Michael Peterson bottom turn and coming up and doing that—it was double overhead a couple of years ago. We had a real big swell at Point Dume. Yes. And I remember one I caught, I went—I was right out the back—and I just got this one big, just did one big bottom turn, low as I could, just going as fast as you like, up, and just did this—did one big highline and then jumped off the wave and realized that I'd gone like 200 meters. Yeah. The fastest, most amazing highline I've ever done. I'll remember that wave for the rest of my life. And not only is it cool and it feels amazing, it's functional because you make big sections and it just opens your mind up to what's possible on a surfboard.
Devon Howard
Yeah.
Michael Frampton
Once you've made a section like that, then you go, and then you get on your normal board or a different board, you're like, I'm going to have a crack at making that. And you might just surprise yourself, because not only have you had that feeling and it's opened your mind to how big a section you can make. Yeah. The only way that you did that was because you were on a bigger board and you've probably spent some time on it and you've actually learned to read the wave in a different way because of the equipment you're on. Yeah. That's great, and that's why one of these boards is nice to have. You know, there will be moments—I do think some of the conditions that are challenging to ride a mid-length is really small waves. And the reason is simple. It's a lot of rail. In most of the designs—I'm not going to say this is true for every design—but most of the designs are going to feel a bit cumbersome in a small wave. There's no rule on mid-length, but there is sort of an unwritten one, which is: well, you know, how long do I go? Where do I start if I've never had one? You know, I think this is a good point to get into is, if I'm going to go order one from my local shaper or go into a shop, where do I start? And I generally, you know, I've said the same thing. I go about a foot over your height if you're kind of an average ability. Most people will feel pretty good with that. If you're of a really high level or you come from a really strong shortboard background, maybe about 10 inches over your height—possibly even eight. I wouldn't go any less than that because there's a point of diminishing returns. You won't have enough glide to do the kind of surfing that you and I have been talking about. It really becomes a different sort of thing. It stays sort of as a big shortboard, and you'll find yourself having to pump it and surf it in more of a shortboard way. Again, there's no rules. If that's your thing, by all means. But if you want to do the kind of surfing we've been sharing, and if you watch the videos that you're going to share, you want to be sort of in that 10 to 12 inch zone. And if you're on the lower end of things—let's say you're not of a great ability—maybe you want to be in that 14 to 16 inches over your height.
And then, of course, based off of body weight. So for reference, I'm six feet one inch, maybe minus a hair. And then, depending on the season, I weigh approximately 190 pounds. And if you do kilos, for some quick math, I'll do it real quick. You do divided by 2.2. So for anyone that's curious, I'd be about 86 kilos. And so the boards I'm generally liking—my favorite size is about 7'0". I hover in the 6'11" to 7'1" zone. And I would say the average thickness—I'm not riding anything less than two and three-quarters thick for me. Thickness is relative to the shaper. A 2 3/4" thickness in a Channel Islands might feel slightly different with a different shaper. So don't, you know, go and feel it out and put your hand on—like, that's not just like a straight across rule. But I actually probably like 2 13/16" or 2 7/8", but I'm a little bit on the... I'm a hair above the average common body size and type. You know, where I think 5'10", 5'11" for most men is the common. 175, you know, that's probably your average for healthy people. If you're not eating too many Big Macs, you should be in that zone. So that's always something people are curious about, I think. "How do I size my mid-length?" is a great question. And a lot of times your surf shops are... they're just not going to know. You know, not everyone's an expert in there. So, go aim for that 12 inch in most cases. Put your hands on the rail. Me, personally, I don't like designs that are super thick on the rail. And the reason is, that the type of surfing we're doing is going to ask a lot of you as a surfer and your surfboard, which is to engage the rail. So again, you go back and you look at those videos and photos. When I'm in the water, probably a good three-quarters of the rail is in there. Maybe more. And that takes some speed, some timing, and to dip that rail in—what we like to call knifing into it—you want the rails to be a little bit foiled. So my 2 3/4" or 2 13/16", I work with the shaper to bring it down. I'm obviously biased to the CI board, but this applies to anybody that you're working with. So have that discussion with the shaper if you're ordering a custom. Like, "Hey, I don't want to have too porky or too boxy of rails." Because you'll feel it kind of like fighting it, you know? It's almost going to feel like it wants to cork out of the water. And to really get the most out of it and dip in and knife and get through, help yourself by keeping the rail a little bit—what we call—foiled. Does that make sense?
Michael Frampton
Totally, yeah. That's a good point. And yeah, you've got to get the size right. And what you just mentioned as well was the appropriate waves for that type of board. Now, this board—your mid-length—is going to catch small waves easier than your shortboard, but that's not what it's for. You might as well be on a longboard if those are the conditions, in my opinion. I agree. So that's sort of the chest high and under. My feeling is, in most cases, you're gonna wanna ride a fish—something skatey, you know? A groveler or whatever, or a fish. Or straight-up longboard. If it's really mushy, I think a fish is kind of better, or a little mini Simmons. I think longboards tend to do better when it's small but there's a little bit of something to kind of get going on. To go back to our nose riding discussion we had—it's been a few years now, but all that info is still relevant.
And then, yeah, I think when you get in that chest-high to a few feet overhead, that's a nice space to be in for a mid-length because now you've really opened up the canvas. And you'll—if you watch those clips—you'll see some of your favorite clips that you'll gravitate toward. The waves are at least shoulder- to head-high. Now you're kind of getting all that use out of the rail. When it's really small, to try to turn and get in that little pocket, you might find yourself a little frustrated.
So not all of us can have more than one board. So that's totally understandable. And if you can only have one board, you absolutely can make the mid-length work. But I think you would want to approach it a little differently in small waves. Maybe take off a little bit deeper. Give yourself kind of a run behind the pocket. So that you can come up into the tight spot, and then when you go to turn the board, just don't try to turn it all the way back to the whitewater. Maybe just do sort of like little half turns and redirects, and be a little more patient with the surfing. Because I have seen people try to ride mid-lengths in small waves and get frustrated, and they're doing what I call over-surfing the board and trying to press their will against it, like, "I'm going to rip it and do it." And it's just—it's not going to happen, because it's just simple physics. It's a lot of rail in a small space, and it's just not going to fit.
That's why the shorter rail—a fish or a shortboard—makes a lot more sense in small surf. I think we should add one other thing. A lot of people ask, "Well, how do you get out on a—you know, I'm used to riding a shortboard and I duck dive?" And I do think that's a great question. Obviously, if you're at a point break, you're going to have a channel, so that's generally not a concern. Unless you're at a point that has a shore pound... then I would just recommend you time your paddle out really well. But if you're at a space where you're going to be duck diving, or you're going to need to duck dive—of course, if you had to and weren't comfortable—you can look around, if no one's around, and if you have a leash on, which most of us do, just toss the board and swim under. It's a bit of extra work, but the good news with that is, the board—if you mistimed the duck dive—the worst thing that could happen is the board hits you in the face.
If you are comfortable duck diving and you're ready to try this, my recommendation is to start doing your push-ups and get that push-up game really good. Strong. Because you're going to be doing a push-up and a plank. Well, that's kind of redundant. A push-up and a plank is the same thing. You're going to be doing a plank. Let me rephrase that.
To duck dive a mid-length, you're going to want to do a plank, which—if you're not familiar with the plank—it's when you put your hands out and do a push-up, and then you're up on your tippy toes. So we're going to kind of want to do that on the mid-length, where we're doing a push-up. So we're going to bend either our right or left a little bit and get that big toe and sort of find the space of the board that's pretty close to where the leash is. Or if you want, you could use your knee and push your knee into the board like you do on a shortboard.
But there's one big difference between duck diving and punching under a wave on a mid-length and a shortboard: you're going to want to add in the scoop. And the scoop is when you push pressure on one rail and dip the board under the water as though you're taking a—you know, like if you have a shovel, and if you want to shovel underneath something—you want to kind of like dip and scoop. And then as the wave comes over you, the whitewater comes over, then you have a nice firm grip of the board and pull it to your chest and keep your face up away from the board. Like when you're doing a duck dive, if you're not paying attention and you do it where the lip comes and there's a concussion, it can really hurt. You could break your nose, right?
So you've got to be careful where you're choosing to do a duck dive. The duck dives I'm talking about, generally speaking, the wave's already broken and it's whitewater coming at you. And it's of what you think is a reasonable size to be safe. In someone with my experience, I will duck dive a wave that's maybe six to eight feet, and that's probably about as much as I'm going to be able to do. Anything over that, I'm just probably going to bail the board.
And bailing a board is quite a dangerous thing if there's a group of people around you. So I might be stating the obvious to the experienced people, but I think the experienced people will appreciate us noting that if you have to bail the board, look around you and please make sure no one is anywhere near where that leash could stretch out to. If you don't have that option, there's no shame in paddling to the beach. If you're in a situation and there's a big wave coming and there's a group of people around you, make an immediate decision. Get on your stomach and paddle toward the beach to get on the other side of those surfers. Then you can throw your board. And these are like split-second things, but they're important for safety. And I don't think it's really talked about that much. We generally don't talk about sort of these protocols and safety, but we have the time to have this conversation. It's not something I usually get to mention.
Michael Frampton
But... I want to add to that because... first of all, I've never heard that of just getting a little bit of angle. I can duck dive a mid-length, but it's hard. I've never thought of just giving a little bit of—just a little bit of rail to get under. That's genius. Yeah, thank you for that. And I always—I mean, I ditch my—I'll put my hand up, I ditch my board in those situations too, but I always look behind me. And the worst thing as an experienced surfer is to look behind you and see that someone is right there. It's like, why are you there?
So I would say if you're behind someone who's paddling out and you think they're going to duck dive, don't assume that. Go sideways. Get out of their way. Because sometimes I'm like, shit, I have to duck dive, there's someone behind me, but I just can't hold on to my board.
Yeah, you...
Devon Howard
...probably end up getting entangled with them, doing your best. That's what happens. That's a great point. Don't tailgate somebody. And I'm very—I do that. I'm paddling out and I'm like, okay, where is this person? I try to get ten feet to the left or right so that if they lose their board or if their duck dive fails—which happens—and with your best intentions, you can get blown apart under there and just yard sale, right?
So with the mid-length, yeah, that scoop, you know, where it's like the board, and then I just sort of dip and I scoop. And to make it successful, you scoop, but then you have to stabilize the board.
So I've scooped and I've pushed it underwater, but I'm stabilizing, getting ready for that thing coming.
And then when it comes over me... I get a good grip and I pull it near me and then I go up through the back of the wave. And you know, sometimes it doesn't work.
Sometimes there's a lot of turbulence. Let's be honest, it's definitely like probably the most challenging aspect of having a mid-length is trading off the safety and the ease of duck diving.
You know, I don't think that—I don't want to sugarcoat it—but I, you know, I don't think it's like the worst thing. You just got to pick the spots you're going to, you know, and—but it's like if you have a step-up gun and you're going to, like, a big beach break, you're going to be struggling about the same amount, I'd...
Michael Frampton
...say. And sometimes, yeah, just... if you—especially if you caught the first wave of the set—just go into the beach, wait for the set to finish, and then just paddle back out. You save your energy.
Don't tailgate people when you're paddling back out. In fact, get away, because especially if the waves are big or if there's surge on a high tide, you can move around a lot. And one person could move a lot more than you. Make sure you have plenty of distance, especially if the waves are big.
Yeah. Stay away from people. Don't assume that they know how to duck dive. Absolutely. I think those are some of the basic points. I'm sure there's other detailed things, but is there anything you think we didn't get to?
Michael Frampton
No, it's awesome. It's a great little... run down on the mid-length. Thank you. I think they're great boards. I think the biggest reason you don't see—people get frustrated with them, but they're not surfing them correctly, like you mentioned, and they're just taking them out when it's really small. I get frustrated.
So you've cleared up a lot of stuff. That's awesome.
Devon Howard
Thankfully, mid boards and longboards are there for if you ever hit a wall where it's just getting too challenging on a shortboard. But yeah, I try to recommend everyone to have one of each. If you're lucky enough to afford three boards—which I know we all are not able to do that—but... if you could strive to have that offering. And I think it looks like you've sort of achieved that. It looks like you've got a big wave gun back there too.
Yeah. And that's a really good place to be. And as you were saying, all of these boards are—they teach you something. And the longboard is really informative for the mid-length, and the mid-length is quite informative for the shortboard.
So it's a pretty cool little grouping of surfboards.
Michael Frampton
Have. Yeah, you can never have too many.
Devon Howard
No, too many surfboards, too many boats, too many sets of clubs. I don't know where we live in it. If you can afford it, go for it.
Michael Frampton
If you can't afford it, save your money. Because if you're a surfer and you're serious about surfing, then you just can't have one surfboard. It doesn't make it. It's like going to the golf course with one club.
I know. You might get away with it. You get away with it. You have fun. It's just so much better to have it—and buy fiberglass boards—because if you look after them, they last a long...
Devon Howard
...time. Yeah, I like...
You know, I... whatever, the Wave Storms and whatever, you know, they're fun to have, they just don't last very long. And those rails really illustrate my point. The rails on those phony boards were really thick. And you'll see, like, even good surfers riding them, and they have a good time, like, going down straight and whatnot, but... you're not able to really... knife through that bottom turn and just really engage that rail.
So your sort of domestic, traditional-built boards like the ones you have behind you are just so much more refined.
Yes. I would try to—I’d encourage people to aim for that if they can.
Michael Frampton
Yeah, if you've only ridden a soft top and you look at how fat the rail is, if you get a fiberglass board with as fat a rail, you're going to struggle a lot more. Because I find that the soft tops, the only reason you can get those fat rails in the water is because they bend and flex so much.
Yeah. It's so forgiving.
Yeah. So you actually don't really get to feel what a fat rail is truly like.
So, yeah. But they are—you’re right—they are fun. And sometimes they're appropriate. So a soft top, if you're a beginner, an absolute beginner, it's—you know, it becomes a safety issue sometimes.
Devon Howard
Sure. And if you're just like a fair-weather surfer, you're going to get—you’re going to go a few times—I get it. You're not going to spend, you know, hundreds and hundreds of dollars to get a surfboard.
Michael Frampton
So, but yeah, if you want to get better at surfing, then you need the right equipment.
Devon Howard
Cool, man. Well, it was nice chatting with you and, yeah, if anyone wants to reach out, I try to do my best to answer questions. And you can find me @devin_howard on Instagram.
Yeah, it was a pleasure talking to you.
Michael Frampton
Right, thanks, Devon. Really appreciate it.
70 How to Surf a Mid-length With Devon Howard
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